Rebuilding Trust in Research: Andrew Moffatt on Behavioral Data and the Future of Insights

In this candid and forward-looking conversation, Greenbook’s Leonard Murphy sits down with Andrew Moffatt, CEO of Qrious Insights, to explore how behavioral data is redefining the future of market research. With decades of experience spanning SSI, Nielsen partnerships, and now leading a pioneering startup, Moffatt shares how his team is building data assets based on real, passively observed behaviors—not just claimed actions. The result? Richer, more reliable insights that reshape everything from sampling to segmentation.

Throughout the interview, Moffatt reflects on the industry's persistent data quality issues and reveals how Qrious is tackling these head-on with scalable, tech-driven solutions. From bypassing routers and long screeners to enabling hyper-targeted surveys grounded in actual behaviors, Qrious is on a mission to eliminate friction for researchers and participants alike. As AI becomes more dependent on high-fidelity data, Moffatt makes a compelling case for why behavioral insights aren't just a nice-to-have—they're foundational to the future of research, marketing, and business intelligence.

Transcript 

Leonard Murphy: Hello everybody. It's Lenny Murphy with another in our CEO series of interviews. And today I am joined by my good friend Andrew Moffatt, CEO of Qrious Insights. Andrew, welcome.

Andrew Moffatt: Thank you, Lenny. Thanks for having me.

Leonard Murphy: Yeah, it's good to have so a little bit of history. Andrew was my sales rep back in the Rockhopper days. he was an SSI and I think he probably just had the bad misfortune of answering a phone or an email or something and he got stuck with me. so we do go way back. yeah probably …

Andrew Moffatt: I remember selling you attempting to sell telephone sample to you back in the days. maybe even in the online days to not date myself much.

Leonard Murphy: but what a long way we've come, right?

Andrew Moffatt: For sure.

Leonard Murphy: though. Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: For sure. industry's changed a lot since we first met,

Leonard Murphy: Yeah, It has. and before we get into all the cool stuff that you're doing about Qrious, obviously I just gave away a little bit of your history, but …

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. …

Leonard Murphy: Go through your origin story, for our listeners.

Andrew Moffatt: So how did I get into research? What I'm doing? I guess I've been here almost 26 years. came straight from Ireland to work at SSI.

Leonard Murphy: Mhm.

Andrew Moffatt: Happened to be the one place that gave me a visa to get into the country way and back in the days before online sample existed. trained in the old telephone sampling, random digit dial different types of representation of sample and got trained by Linda Picarski and others who I classify as some of the best in this space forever honestly and was part of online growing sold the first kind of big online job at SSI  I ended up moving to Europe, spending some time getting sales off the ground in places like France, Germany, UK, Spain, and Australia and other places. and ended up running our Nielsen business all over the world. Which was quite interesting moving work from offline to online building measurement panels and tech all over the world for the largest research company in the world and seeing how they operate from the inside as an outsider but very much part of their organization in terms of how they work. and a lot of what we do today is from that experience honestly. I happened to leave before that.

Leonard Murphy: Very cool. And then acquired or merged, however that played out with research now. Okay.

Andrew Moffatt: So, yeah, about a year before that happened, I happened to leave before that actually happened. So, I didn't have the pleasure of going through the merger between SSI and research now, although some of my co-founders did. So, both of Dave and Mark actually ran up at DA. He was the guy who had the lucky job of integrating I think it was 40 locations and 4,000 people into one company. So easy job …

Leonard Murphy: Easy job. Yeah, cool.

Andrew Moffatt: but gave us a lot of experience allowed us to travel the world allowed us to see research in different parts of the world and see how they operate and it was a wonderful experience really. had a startup in between that I was involved in the data quality side.

Leonard Murphy: And then came Qrious.

Andrew Moffatt: But started what was a consulting firm now Qrious over four years ago and our focus has really been on panels. just to put it in clearer terms, passively observing people's behaviors. so on a mobile device, being able to see passively what apps they're using and what websites they're going to or where they end up in person and trying to engage with people in a little bit differently and research and try to take what we saw as really la creme like the real top quality data that everyone really relied upon for ad measurement, when you think about what people are watching on TV, what people were listening to, it was Nielsen billboard, it was Nielsen ratings telling you what people were doing and that was all based on passively observing people, So this concept of passively observing has been around for a long long time. The issue is that it's really hard to do.  that's really expensive to do and the data that exists within that environment is not easily curated and it's really just left for the larger companies who have large data science teams and things to figure out. but the idea was that if we could actually have a lot more of that data at scale that would be much more powerful than just relying on recall data. So being able to move from recall to hey this is what these people actually did and being able to use that in research in different ways has really been our focus for the last four years. so one how do we get enough people to be able to track and then how do we take the data that's coming off of an individual and turn it into something really usable really fast for people in a way that really hasn't been possible before. Yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: And to make that a virtuous cycle to we've observed that they shopped at Walmart and let's trigger an engagement with them to tell us about your experience at Walmart and Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: For The idea is that you can, hyperarget based on behavior and in a way actually not just engage with them. everyone is engageable but then be able to leverage their behaviors on top of that survey behavior and things like that to deepen the analysis and work that you do.

Leonard Murphy: Mhm.

Andrew Moffatt: So when I take a step back and having kind of watched online grow up and I won't comment necessarily on the state of online survey panels today but there isn't too many places you can go that doesn't talk about data quality being an issue,  And so kind of look at having had a front row seat into most of the online panels in the industry being at SSI because we acquired so many companies. You see what happens a lot of things that exist today have been around for a while and they just haven't been able to be solved. So the first is getting to a real person, So how do you ensure that you have a real person? So you have a lot of digital fingerprinting tools that exist on the front end and they capture sometimes as much as 40% of traffic coming into an environment or into a survey, but they certainly don't catch everyone that is bad coming into your system. because you don't have a way to get to a real person, we've created a series of mechanisms to make sure they're real either through surveys or some tools within how panel companies engage with them. And in the end it requires more of a respondent from a question base to prove they're real. There's really not any technology solutions that allow that to happen, I have this big kind of overarching thing.

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Right.

Andrew Moffatt: And if I look at that in isolation, the real way that companies have found survey based fraud beyond digital fingerprinting up until this point has been very much driven from maybe red herring questions and things like that. But the most optimal way has always been asking them open-ended questions, So, a bot's not smart enough to answer a question in a way that would allow them to go undetected up…

Leonard Murphy: Yet, right?

Andrew Moffatt: until now. And so you've seen AI operator and other types of operators out there,…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: So that's the future of bots and I think the future of real verified people is a necessity in the next immediately honestly it has to be a 2025 thing for most companies and what that will do is restrict supply. and that's kind of what the second problem today is is how you automate and programmatically bring all of that supply into your environment. Right?  So that happens primarily through routers across every single company that operates in this space. Routers are basically set up so that you can understand someone against what you have in terms of real live survey volume at that time or you're creating profiles of people so that you can hyperarget them in some way in the future, right? And that's created a very poor experience for people that are taking surveys and…

Leonard Murphy: You're being so politically correct. Thank you. But go ahead.

Andrew Moffatt: But there's just too many questions that end up in an ecosystem, where it's almost in some ways maybe five or 10 minutes before someone gets to your survey today after getting through everything in order to prove they're real and…

Leonard Murphy: Right?

Andrew Moffatt: to match up to the right survey and to go through a few screeners and do everything. And that's a lot of wasted time, And it's the part of the ecosystem that concerns me the most because it's the participants time that will drive this forward in the future, right?  And so, how do you get to real is important because you have to validate the data you're collecting, but making sure you got people to get data in the beginning is really important. And so, what we've been working on both of those things is trying to use passively collected data to make that whole process work a little bit better. So when it comes to what we like to do is passively observe people and see exactly what they're doing. So are they using auto clicker apps on their phone? is their device plugged in and at 100% charged all the time? are they on certain websites? are they on 50 different panels?  and you can see that and that's all they do within that device, They don't go anywhere else except take surveys and things. we see all of that behavior and we remove them from our data set in the beginning and we get to make sure that we're only selecting from people who we determined to be real. we've done some tests up against survey panels. We perform much better because of our ability to get to real.

Leonard Murphy: Right.

Andrew Moffatt: you obviously have people that aren't great survey takers. You certainly have people that are not great qual participants, So doesn't mean you always get great data all the way through from every single person, but it ensures that the people that are in that environment are real to begin with. And that's the second thing we've done with the behaviors is we've profiled people based on their behaviors.  So rather than asking people, hey, are you interested in golf? Yes or no, we actually know you're interested in golf because we saw you using golf apps or you were watching golf videos on Tik Tok or you're show up in a golf course and that's a much stronger predictor of what your hobbies and interests are. We know exactly what grocery stores you shop at. We know exactly what social media behaviors what platforms you're using And that goes into how we determine what your profile looks like. and so that takes all of that burden of asking 20 30 questionnaires of respondents away, because we're collecting all of this information, we also don't need routers because we can hyperarget your heavy McDonald's buyers or your people who bought Metamucil online or the people that bought, Purina cat food. we see it all within the device. And so we see a world in the future at scale…

Leonard Murphy: All right.

Andrew Moffatt: Where we move from this if we look at the early days of online research everything was one-to-one what I mean by that is you invited one person to one survey right and that's what existed and the world migrated to one to many so let's bring a survey participant into this world and  let us figure out and optimize their experience and the ability to match them to surveys accurately. in the end, I think that's what's caused much of the issues within the industry. It's caused a degradation in the panelist experience and it's the part that needs to get fixed fast. So the ability to track people's behaviors, observe what they're doing gives you the ability to move back to one-to-one because you want to bring that person who had that behavior into your survey and because you see 20,000 things that people are doing every month, you don't need to ask questions about who they are and you wouldn't think of it anyway,  So, if you wanted to find the person who went to a tractor supply store in the past 30 days, you're not going to ask that in a profiling questionnaire. You might ask that real time, right, in your routers, but we know exactly where that person was or they were on that website and you don't have to question it and that's allows us to create that one-to-one. The last part is all that data allows you to actually shorten questionnaires for the first time which is been the crux of say every sample company saying hey you're throwing too many long questionnaires our way it used to be by our data nobody trusted that data because no one trusted the source of the sample and so we're trying to change that approach where the data that you're appending is  actually that person's observed behaviors from the past 30 days or whatever time frame you spoke. So instead of asking in a survey, hey Lenny, how much time did you spend on Facebook last month and how much time did you spend on TikTok and how many times did you go there? And you wouldn't get it right. you'd probably be as much as 80% wrong and B, we can append that to your survey data. So you as a researcher can now have real behaviors that you're appending to your survey data and from there allowing you to do a lot more with your analysis. You can do simple things like create a media plan from a group of concept acceptors just by understanding what media they're spending time on.  or you can go as deep as stripping out half of your segmentation questions and replacing them with behavioral variables to create your segments and things like that. So really able to I think take a researcher and give them the same type of methodology. I want to field the survey but actually bring a lot more information on that person into that analysis so that in the long run we can create shorter surveys. We can eliminate the front end and we know that everyone in the middle is real and that's how we're working on kind of reshaping that view of the world.

Leonard Murphy: That you're preaching to the choir in terms of the vision. I'm sure the audience knows that as well.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Excellent.

Leonard Murphy: So somebody's got to pull it off. I think it's going to be you and there's other companies that are playing in similar arenas. I think what's interesting is that at this whole time that we're trying to make a better primary research experience sampling experience along comes AI and…

Andrew Moffatt: Correct.

Leonard Murphy: There is so much movement towards the buzz term is all synthetic sample okay great but it's got to be based off of real sample real data real data assets and that's how I've begun to kind of think about anybody who has access to audiences to consumers that is a data asset if you can extract and engage and build that with platforms Qrious and it seems as if the demand now is shifting on the ai side from just all the digital exhaust in the world. two focused, single source individualized first party data. to start building real business applications similar to what we think of as research, a concept test, whatever. So…

Andrew Moffatt: Yep. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: It seems like you're getting it from both sides, right? From an opportunity standpoint, we still have the traditional kind of research space and with the more transactional engagement that's needs to be fixed. You're fixing it while at the same time you're enabling this development of the data asset that can feed all of the AI models. Is that kind of your take on Sure. Right.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. So AI itself it's so impressive what it's been able to do in such a short space of time. Honestly, if you asked me five years ago what's going to replace Google in a few years, Google search, I was like nothing. it's not going to happen, and I think it's already changed in a year, right? Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: It has latest numbers that we see it in greenbook from we see our search data and the AI search is increasing while Google is decreasing so yeah and

Andrew Moffatt: And it just changes to me it allows people who done right who aren't necessarily trained researchers to conduct research in the future, and it comes back to your point which is …

Leonard Murphy: Hey.

Andrew Moffatt: what that data set looks like in a way,  So right now much of the data collected in the world outside of people's sites and things like that that's behavioral. A lot of it is actually recall based and survey based and that's feeding a lot of these models. a lot of people have history in those kinds of things. You think a lot of models are built on years of historical data super powerful and it's going to AI will enable all of those things to move faster.  But is as you move forward the most critical thing with AI is the data, right? And the play has been always like you have your own first party I collected these people you see what they do in your apps or your websites or from what interactions you have with them through CRM and different things and then you try to connect that through other third party channels and bring in an understanding of them that might be their profiles or different things.  And there's a lot of money now that going to privacy to spending a lot of money with third party data really just to get a more complete understanding of what a person looks like and again to feed into AI with more outcomes and more predictions that make models stronger. we see so we're creating data assets for people. We're creating data that is observed behavioral data. I think I mentioned it earlier. it's the highest fidelity type data there is in that you're eliminating bias. you're eliminating you're just really observing what's going on. and so our goal is to create behavioral data at scale so that we can be at the source of feeding those and not just AI models today, but also all different types of agents in the future, right?

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yep.

Andrew Moffatt: So, if I look, a few years down the road, I see the world as you're replacing point in time data collection that happens today always on behavioral data collection and then you're having to maybe augment this data with offline data or TV data or other things.  But once you do that then you change what data you need to collect in a survey. to me the role of a survey will change dramatically over the next three years and the ability to interact with that data set rather than running surveys is a way that I see things happening in the future.  But it comes down to how robust that data set is in the beginning and it's got to be fit for purpose for what you're trying to solve. And then on the agent side if you take it a step further if I take an easy example be like a marketing agent where we collect what ads people are watching or seeing passively on social or in Google display ads and things on their devices. we're able to see which of those ads are more successful passively by how long it's taking people to show up at a brand, how long it's taking them to click on a website, go to an app. We also see messaging in those ads. we plan to see creatives in those ads later on this year. And so if you have all of this learning at scale from a large audience, that's what's feeding into your agents. And so you could have look, here's all the ads in QSR. We saw 50 million ads in the past month amongst our audience. which of those are driving the highest engagement? is Tik Tok performing better this week?

Leonard Murphy: All right.

Andrew Moffatt: Is this offer performing better this week? And then being able to feed that in to an agent that understands that and then autonomously go change your campaigns on Google and places like that. that's where we see the future going with this stuff. and we're at the heart of trying to create the data asset at the core of it all that supports all of that.

Leonard Murphy: So, big job. so I want to be and…

Andrew Moffatt: Someone's got to do it, Lenny. Like you said, right?  This is funny.

Leonard Murphy: Audience you guys should do full disclosure, Obviously Andrew and I have known each other for a long time. also I've had the privilege of working pretty closely with you and your team in the last few months and helping to do this. And anybody who's listened to me knows I couldn't pull off what you were doing. I tried and I failed. And you are not failing and that's amazing that that's happening and it's been a privilege to try and play some small role in telling you what not to do based on my own experience just full disclosure audience but totally agree that's where we're going the all signs point to there I was looking I used to have a magic aball on my desk somewhere I don't have it anymore but I'd shake it up and all signs point to yes we are that is just not in the future that's near term happening now just not fully realized and scaled out yet but we're there already. So that's cool.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: Here you are with an ambitious project truly transformative in many ways as a startup because you're still early stage …

Andrew Moffatt: Yes. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: What have you learned along the way from that standpoint right of going on this journey of trying to tackle a great big honking problem that has a great big opportunity the but you're scrapping, as a startup. what's been the lesson there?

Andrew Moffatt: Gosh...so many. we got another podcast going on.

Leonard Murphy: Don't do it.

Andrew Moffatt: I work for a company and watched them grow up a long time. I probably never fully appreciated having the support of different functions and money to do different things along the way. it's been the hardest thing that I've ever done and professionally, but then also personally because you don't really grow a business without growing yourself, I don't think, and so it kind of pushes you in every direction. we took a challenging time to try to do anything because it happened right in the middle of CO. And they say I did read that sometimes the best things like start in really challenging times but it also created an environment I think over the last few years where people didn't want to spend money on new platforms and new tools and we're were scaling back in terms of the inventory of platforms and things that they had rather than investing in anything new and…

Leonard Murphy: Yep. That's Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: And a lot of them actually shut down bringing on new suppliers and just we're capped, so the journey is quite hard because you're dealing with a lot of setbacks. People's timing is never the timing you want to survive in the way that you want, so really the only thing that gets you true is believing in what you're doing honestly. and that belief comes in different ways and it can go at different times based on what happens as well and…

Leonard Murphy: Right. Right.

Andrew Moffatt: and you have to kind of get through it. So, obviously the biggest thing is having someone a big name out there like buying your stuff and validating what you're doing. luckily we're in that boat right now, but we lost opportunities that we should have won because we didn't have the brand name of a big research agency and things like that, so we've had to like and we also have a product that we could have created anything from honestly which is kind of weird to say but because you see everyone's behaviors you can create a retail product you could create an ad product you could create a survey product you could create just your full service research firm. You could do just creating data and so figuring out where you belong in the world and…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: and what role you want to play and then committing to that. but not in a way that's like this is what I'm doing because that's kind of the death of a startup but just having some kind of north star that you kind of want to live against and for us it's actually trying to create a new methodology and the re be a big one so that takes time and so our first phase we kind of was just bootstrapped for a couple of years and figured out what we had and then at one point we were like this is too good not to become a business. So we went out and raised some money to stop consulting basically and then you've got other people to answer to and talk to but also help you kind of get through that phase.

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. As in life, right?

Andrew Moffatt: And I would say along the way because the hardest thing about a startup is probably just not having money honestly as much as you would like you can't invest ahead you have to think short term right you just have to think shorter term honestly because you don't have the resources to think beyond that right and so I actually had this conversation with someone yesterday I said I would have made different decisions if I had  money at different times, and maybe not the right ones. even though it may have felt right at the time, the one thing you need most is just resilience honestly and just being able to pivot and get through and find that path forward and be resilient about it. And we're out, raising more money. We're doing our thing. Where we believe in we believe so much in what we're doing right now that I kind of think it can't fail because we've seen too much evidence to know how much it solves current problems to know that it will.

Leonard Murphy: All right.

Andrew Moffatt: So I would say for the past 18 months, even though at times may have been really challenging to get through from a startup point of view, our belief has gotten stronger. And that's the one thing that's without that, I think, you're kind of dead. you need to know that you're into that idea and that concept and you really want to bring it to life and that's what drives you more than anything else.  So

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. there's a kind of a self-reinforcing component of that. It's almost like boot camp, right? Or any other goal set and that's challenging and you go through that and the more you succeed in going through it solving problems building that resilience …

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: Then the more confident you become and to go through that it's going through the crucable and that may be almost the requirement to be a successful entrepreneur but I know for myself all of my failures As much as I regret my failures from the standpoint of, affected other people or time lost or whatever, right? I'm not woo that was great. But absolutely appreciative of the experiences and think that I'm better for that overall. Although I'm glad that I'm not a CEO right now because you go do those things.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. totally totally I also call myself unemployable now as well. So

Leonard Murphy: But that learning process it makes us better people I think. absolutely dude. I'm the most unemployable person on the planet. I tell I'm an entrepreneur. Why do you think that? It's because nobody else would hire me. So I'm too big of a pain in the ass and I had to feed my family. So I'm an entrepreneur now. So, how do I turn my character flaws into motivation?

Andrew Moffatt: For sure. But I have the utmost respect for honestly anyone who's done it and succeeded and got over that hump and has their own kind of business they're leading just because it is so challenging. it's been eye opening actually how difficult it is to do something like that and in our world we have to educate people to buy as well which is a little bit harder right so we're taking people on a journey it's not like you're switching out someone immediately right and you're convincing people like this this is the future right and…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Right. It's not a better widget. It's not an upgraded widget. So, yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: So those timelines are also longer and they're the curse of a startup in a way, Because the more time it takes, the less money you have to get there, right? So,…

Leonard Murphy: Yeah. Yeah. But I said, that validation comes then that gives you more belief and the more people start to, come on board that just snowballs and our snowball is getting bigger every day now. So, yeah. Which also has it own share of challenges, right? You remember the FedEx commercial where the people just went online, and they see the first order come in and they're " great." Then it starts getting bigger and bigger and it's that s*** moment, right? But is it going to work?

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: S***, it worked. what do we do? Now we got to deliver. so sure.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. we're in that phase right now and it's very challenging. Yeah. It's very difficult because you sell your product, you try so hard, you get your opportunity, right? And people believe in it and then you have to deliver against it no matter what,…

Leonard Murphy: Right.

Andrew Moffatt: so yeah, it's hard. We're out hiring aggressively right now to support the growth. And it's a good problem to have. it's a different set of challenges right and so that's why we're raising more money to basically think beyond a few months ahead right so allow us to look 24 months ahead hire the right people make the right decisions because I think we're just scaling what we've built rather than figuring out product market fit and all of that kind of stuff yeah we're hopeful that goes fast and makes our lives a lot easier. but yeah, cash is king for growing, And what's also interesting is bigger companies don't necessarily pay fast either, So, you're as a smaller company like fronting a lot of things just to get opportunity. And yeah,…

Leonard Murphy: Yep. Yeah...

Andrew Moffatt: it feels like a weird dynamic in that sense, but it's part of what you got to do. Yeah, exactly.

Leonard Murphy: I'm many of a company that have almost gone winning a big contract with a very large company. but that waiting for the payment that's a whole other conversation, right? It's like come on guys, please pay especially if you're dealing with a smaller company, don't make them be your bank. So …

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. So I'd like and…

Leonard Murphy: who you are. Big brands, you know who you are. Or pay fast. So yeah...

Andrew Moffatt: the other challenging part too honestly is banks don't give startups money for the first two three years right your normal channels of getting cash are kind of dried up and you're kind of left out to yourself to figure things out. So having not raised cash lighter before that's also an interesting challenge trying to go through find investors sell them on your vision sell them on your concept it's like yeah no it's not…

Leonard Murphy: And it's a time raising cash is just as much full-time job as selling. and the more that you focus on raising, the less you can focus on selling. I mean, it's again part of that crucable process for entrepreneurs. It's not easy. Right.

Andrew Moffatt: but we're four years into it. I think we've built up a lot of resilience. we've built a lot of really cool things and ready to scale. I love scaling SSI when we were there, we scaled it quite a bit. The difference is they had cash, right, to be able to spend and invest quickly and things. So we need to get ourselves into that space to do that which is what we're doing right now. and then scaling is hard but I like scaling because there's a great energy in scaling. Yeah people are excited people see the future the potential and…

Leonard Murphy: Yep.

Andrew Moffatt: you get the right people when you're scaling you can create a lot of energy and move very fast.  So, I'm excited for this year to start doing some of that stuff meaningfully and start building some energy out there and moving people more and more to at least experiencing or touching behavioral in a way they haven't before. and the more people we can do that to obviously the faster we get to grow. I left SampleCon yesterday. I was there for two days. I had 30 meetings I think in two days. It was insane. I showed everyone behavioral and most reactions are wow this is what's possible. it's the dream of not just grabbing a person in a point in time. it's that person in a point in time but understanding what brought them there, right? So what ads and…

Leonard Murphy: right? Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: What shopping and who they are and what people they are. So, yeah.

Leonard Murphy: Terms like multi-touch attribution, path to purchase, all of those things, what is it? Google called it the zero moment of truth, I think, of getting to that understanding how people get to the decision.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Powerful and…

Leonard Murphy: But without asking them. Hugely powerful and Yeah.

Andrew Moffatt: And brands are starting to see it, Because we're showing them more and that's just a matter of time, before they start to want more of that stuff. And so it's a timing game, it's hard sometimes, but ultimately very rewarding when you get people on your side and moving in that direction.  and behavioral is here to stay and it's going to grow and has the power to do a lot of things and I'm so really excited we're in the middle of it all and we kind of have figured out our way of trying to solve the problem whether everyone kind of jumps on board or believes in or not it doesn't really matter because I think we're going to build it regardless and that it will join. And we've got a couple of different sides. We have our network side which is people who want to create their own data assets who want and sometimes to understand their audience or make money from their audience or start changing how things are working.  And the supplier base coming on board is really interesting because that allows the future to happen if you can take the existing supply in the ecosystem and move them slowly into behavioral and then the more you do that the client side are also kind of moving faster too in asking for behavioral at the same time. so AI will change the industry immensely. I see it over the next five years. I don't know the role of a what a of a what the role of a research company looks like in five years or a consulting firm and what tool set they're using. But I don't see them using a lot of the same tool sets they're using today. yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: Yes. And the but the need for data will not change. And even again we touched on make sure for audience sample purely synthetic madeup made of that sounds dispiritual mean that way but the type of synthetic sample that is built off of public data sources it use cases. But it is not the same as building personas off of real data at the consumer level,…

Andrew Moffatt: Real people.

Leonard Murphy: Real people off the consumer level and…

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. always.

Leonard Murphy: And we'll see more of that from the standpoint of view we'll go and ask the existing data set first before asking a new question. But there will always be the need to ask new questions to fill in gaps but it all rests on to your point. Yeah. All those other pieces may change. What won't change is the need for understanding humans to answer a business question related to the human.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Yeah.

Leonard Murphy: And you'll be powering that. And, so, yep. Right.

Andrew Moffatt: Just ask them the questions you want to know because you trust everything else around them. it's really just replacing trust. And the only way you can replace trust is by having something you can actually trust, which is observed behaviors. and it's fundamental. That's all we're really doing,

Leonard Murphy: Right. Yeah. We saw that you were driving past McDonald's. and you had recently seen after McDonald's. You pulled into McDonald's. We know that you ordered, …

Andrew Moffatt: Right. Right. A double cheeseburger with fries. Great. We have all that. But what a taste. Why'd you go there versus going to Chipotle,…

Leonard Murphy: Right. Right. Right. What? Yes. The …

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. Right.

Leonard Murphy: How is your service? And those questions are seem to be important questions that we will need to ask to get there.

Andrew Moffatt: Totally. try behavioral honestly you'll be blown away about…

Leonard Murphy: Andrew, you and I can go on for a long time. I want to be conscious of your time as well as the listeners.  Is there any final thoughts that you want to share before we ap up? Spoken like the entrepreneur. So...

Andrew Moffatt: how powerful it is and how easy we make it for you right that's really been our job right so let's take something as powerful as behavioral and let's put it into a place as a researcher as a marketing person within your organization touch insights, can touch behavioral in a way that's comfortable to you and easy for you to consume. and now's the time to do it. Honestly, I'm here.

Leonard Murphy: There you go. There's that CEO message. Andh I got it.

Andrew Moffatt: I've got an audience, Lenny. you can't.

Leonard Murphy: I got it, I saw what you were doing putting in there like we're raising money. We're hiring. come try.

Andrew Moffatt: We're here.

Leonard Murphy: Absolutely. And I will encourage audience do that.

Andrew Moffatt: Yeah. 

Leonard Murphy: So on that note of whether you want to help them with the investment, buy services or you want to work for them, how can people reach you? Help me.

Andrew Moffatt: LinkedIn's probably always the best way. and you're making me sound like I should have a Jerry Magcguire moment or something. And who's coming with me,…

Leonard Murphy: Help you. All On that note, we should probably wrap up. All right. So, LinkedIn. okay.

Andrew Moffatt: LinkedIn, yeah, is always the best way. I'm on there all the time.  Thank you.

Leonard Murphy: Thank you so much. Best of luck. Obviously listeners, as I hit my camera and mess it up, reach out to Andrew. we'll be back for another edition of the CEO series soon with somebody else. And in the meantime, thanks to our producers, and most of all to our listeners. Everybody, take care. Thank you. Bye-bye.